Diff trap... Again.

[Radacoin]

+1. Very well said!

[quote name=“digitalfog” post=“26006” timestamp=“1377024894”]
Although one would think they were “making bank” by being on a pool switcher, it all evens down to a lower return due to a dozen reasons. (Falling prices/diff settings/stales/orphans/switching time/pool luck.)
[/quote]

And not to forget the tiny volume on the smaller exchanges like Crytpsy, Vircurex or Bter.
One coin might be listed as #1 on coinchoose, with a profitability of 700%, and an exchange rate of 0.00005xxx.

But in reality you get this 0.00005xxx only for a handful of coins. All your other coins you have to sell for much less. It’s not uncommon that the whole Bid side for one of those coins is only 1 or 1.5 BTC - all the way down from 0.00005xxx to 0.00003xxx.

So in reality the 700% profitability from coinchoose are more like 300%. Or even less …

[quote]
So with that, I’d prefer to see more Feathercoin adoption among the business community. In the end, e-commerce transactions using Feathercoin will be the vital bread and butter for success.
[/quote]

Yes, absolutely!

[digitalfog]

[quote name=“Radacoin” post=“26017” timestamp=“1377030626”]
+1. Very well said!

And not to forget the tiny volume on the smaller exchanges like Crytpsy, Vircurex or Bter.
One coin might be listed as #1 on coinchoose, with a profitability of 700%, and an exchange rate of 0.00005xxx.

But in reality you get this 0.00005xxx only for a handful of coins. All your other coins you have to sell for much less. It’s not uncommon that the whole Bid side for one of those coins is only 1 or 1.5 BTC - all the way down from 0.00005xxx to 0.00003xxx.

[/quote]

Thank you…and absolutely! Vacuous bid side markets are alive and well in alt. crypto land.

[svennand]

[quote name=“digitalfog” post=“26006” timestamp=“1377024894”]
Feathercoin seems to be doing just fine against the plethora of new coins. It tends to be in the top 15 of average “highest profitability” coins.

I’ve spent the last two weeks testing multicoin and middlecoin - so you can call me a cruiser this past month. I wasn’t overly impressed with my results. What I found is that I am generally better off mining Feathercoin exclusively.

Mining for DGC or WDC drives me nuts because of the huge stale / orphan rate. Even on the best network, you are not going to get very close to “estimated” coins per hour/day. Although one would think they were “making bank” by being on a pool switcher, it all evens down to a lower return due to a dozen reasons. (Falling prices/diff settings/stales/orphans/switching time/pool luck.)

Also, notice the weakness in prices? The ever lower prices? All of these automatic sell transactions on multi-pools don’t happen in a vacuum.

So with that, I’d prefer to see more Feathercoin adoption among the business community. In the end, e-commerce transactions using Feathercoin will be the vital bread and butter for success.
[/quote]

Both DGC and WDC has had issues lately so a pro “switch miner” would most likely not direct his power there…
As regarding multipools, they are noe entirely the only to “blame”.

If someone have a farm of miners its not that much to it to create a script to switch coins your mining.

For example: say the diff of feathercoin is getting pumped up.

Now the only thing he needs is to have a script running that reads the feed from feathercoin stat, then have a method that runs and awaits for the stat value to change.
Example in java (its just dirty unusable code, but hope you get the idea):

private void setCoin(){

double ftcDiff == the feed…

if(ftcDiff < 200){
updateFtcDiff();
}
else{ runCmdToCgminer(); }
}

Now he only needs to set up several pool options in cgminer, and make the java program send an request to cgminer to change pool…

If i were to actually create something like this i would do it much more aggressive and creative.
Counting in all kinds of things like exchange value, list of coin options i know would trade easily and so on…

Example if i were to mine novacoin now and sell it for ftc i would get 25% more ftc coins in the same amount of time… that means while the loyal
miner gets 750 coins in a day, the same miner could get 1000coins in a day just by doing some effort in script controlling.

This is what i think needs to be dealt with. As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.

[Radacoin]

[quote name=“svennand” post=“26023” timestamp=“1377032375”]
As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.
[/quote]

I tend to agree with you.
The diff swings need to be addressed in the very near future. imho.
(-> stability … my most favourite word it seems *g*)

In the bigger picture digitalfog (“In the end, e-commerce transactions using Feathercoin will be the vital bread and butter for success.”) is spot on.

Can we agree on this?

[svennand]

[quote name=“Radacoin” post=“26024” timestamp=“1377034298”]
[quote author=svennand link=topic=3327.msg26023#msg26023 date=1377032375]
As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.
[/quote]

I tend to agree with you.
The diff swings need to be addressed in the very near future. imho.
(-> stability … my most favourite word it seems *g*)

In the bigger picture digitalfog (“In the end, e-commerce transactions using Feathercoin will be the vital bread and butter for success.”) is spot on.

Can we agree on this?
[/quote]

of course.
im just adressing the current problem :D

as soon as this is the past im looking forward to get the coin wider spread 8)

EDIT:
Now the network is down to 2000Mhash, that 1/6 of the previouse hashrate before diff increase.

[rob_1990]

The price on the exchange has dropped. The difficulty is up again. It looks like another day (or 2) of high diff. :(

[svennand]

[quote name=“Simkill” post=“26039” timestamp=“1377080941”]
and the net rate has significantly decreased, leaving me and you in the poo
[/quote]

been here before. just hold on tight and dont get nervouse.
Im certain that this setback will be resolved ;)

[tuneman1980]

[quote name=“svennand” post=“26023” timestamp=“1377032375”]
Example if i were to mine novacoin now and sell it for ftc i would get 25% more ftc coins in the same amount of time… that means while the loyal
miner gets 750 coins in a day, the same miner could get 1000coins in a day just by doing some effort in script controlling.

This is what i think needs to be dealt with. As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.
[/quote]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if you choose that method then aren’t you helping the value, since you have to purchase those coins on an exchange now.

[birddog]

[quote name=“tuneman1980” post=“26046” timestamp=“1377092013”]
[quote author=svennand link=topic=3327.msg26023#msg26023 date=1377032375]
Example if i were to mine novacoin now and sell it for ftc i would get 25% more ftc coins in the same amount of time… that means while the loyal
miner gets 750 coins in a day, the same miner could get 1000coins in a day just by doing some effort in script controlling.

This is what i think needs to be dealt with. As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.
[/quote]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if you choose that method then aren’t you helping the value, since you have to purchase those coins on an exchange now.
[/quote]

Thats an interesting thought. I believe you are correct.

[svennand]

[quote name=“tuneman1980” post=“26046” timestamp=“1377092013”]
[quote author=svennand link=topic=3327.msg26023#msg26023 date=1377032375]
Example if i were to mine novacoin now and sell it for ftc i would get 25% more ftc coins in the same amount of time… that means while the loyal
miner gets 750 coins in a day, the same miner could get 1000coins in a day just by doing some effort in script controlling.

This is what i think needs to be dealt with. As long as the pump/dump continues on the coin i cant see neither the diff or the value go anywhere anytime soon.
[/quote]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but if you choose that method then aren’t you helping the value, since you have to purchase those coins on an exchange now.
[/quote]

not if im paying close attention to fontas and store the value in btc.
just buy low when diff is low and sell later at higher value/diff.

then you make an even better killing as opposed to the loyal miner/holders/ftc users.
Look at exhange now… does it look like the diff trap is working?

[justabitoftime]

How about something like:

168 blocks ~ 14%

[b]Maybe [/b]some type of conditions that state if we’re stuck in a difficulty trap for x amount of time and an adjustment wasn’t made, make y adjustment. Just tossing out an idea, not married to it by any means.

I also agree with education being the key. I feel what I’m about to detail is still on topic since there’s been discussion about educating the miners and general public.

One way to help push that along would be to create a FeathercoinFacts type website which highlight the following:

• Why sites such as coinchoose are useful to see movement within currencies, they are not real good indicator on investment based on market depth

• When the retarget is eventually modified, explain why

• When ACP is released, focus on all the advantages

• When Mark releases his SMS wallet out of alpha, took about it how it could be used to help poorer communities by eliminating the need for smart phones

!!! - Show the progression from Bitcoin to Tenebrix (scrypt) to Fairbrix to Litecoin to Feathercoin

• This would clean up the misunderstanding from the general public that Litecoin was the first to implement scrypt

• It respects Litecoin by showing that small modifications done the right way can further an idea

• It would show with ACP, Feathercoin is following the tradition by improving on past work

• This might even make a great 1 page pdf

• Maybe show something along the lines of Bitcoin went for x amount in 2009, now it’s worth $, Litecoin went for x in 2011, now it’s worth $, Feathercoin …

Just an idea.

If you make it a big deal, so will others. Feathercoin is at the stage where we need to start finding ways to make it easy to obtain and detail all the reasons to invest.

[svennand]

[quote name=“Justabitoftime” post=“26055” timestamp=“1377108646”]
How about something like:

168 blocks ~ 14%
[/quote]

maybe, should be in the suggestion box along with other diff adjustment values.

[quote]
[b]Maybe [/b]some type of conditions that state if we’re stuck in a difficulty trap for x amount of time and an adjustment wasn’t made, make y adjustment. Just tossing out an idea, not married to it by any means.
[/quote]

this is interessting, i have suggested this before without getting any attention.
Cant entirely se how this is feasible however.
I have not looked at how the chain/code is built up regarding diff adjustment/time etc.
Im guessing theres a method that uses calculation of network hash given amount of time to find blocks?
It might be able to have a method in there that is using several key internation clock values (not have it relying on one feed). Which could lay dorment and activates if the “estimated” block time is going a certain prosentage beyond the specified 2.5min pr block.

Maybe someone with closer connection to the code can shed some lights on this?

[quote]
I also agree with education being the key. I feel what I’m about to detail is still on topic since there’s been discussion about educating the miners and general public.

One way to help push that along would be to create a FeathercoinFacts type website which highlight the following:

• Why sites such as coinchoose are useful to see movement within currencies, they are not real good indicator on investment based on market depth

• When the retarget is eventually modified, explain why

• When ACP is released, focus on all the advantages

• When Mark releases his SMS wallet out of alpha, took about it how it could be used to help poorer communities by eliminating the need for smart phones

!!! - Show the progression from Bitcoin to Tenebrix (scrypt) to Fairbrix to Litecoin to Feathercoin

• This would clean up the misunderstanding from the general public that Litecoin was the first to implement scrypt

• It respects Litecoin by showing that small modifications done the right way can further an idea

• It would show with ACP, Feathercoin is following the tradition by improving on past work

• This might even make a great 1 page pdf

• Maybe show something along the lines of Bitcoin went for x amount in 2009, now it’s worth $, Litecoin went for x in 2011, now it’s worth $, Feathercoin …

Just an idea.
[/quote]

I think this is a smart idea and should be highly considered :D

[wrapper]

I agree, however, the difficulty should be adjusted every 100 blocks, based on the average block rate for 100, 1000 and 10,000 blocks. This will help with both our main problems,

1. Short term hash switching.
2. Failure to reach the Long term (monthly) target Block production rate.

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[netnerd]

here we go again already at 9.5gh :'( defo not fair for loyal FTC miners like myself, please do something :-\
Not very encouraging, as I am throwing every bit of spare cash at FTC trying to get a 4x7950 rig together ( I AM NOT RICH!!!), I now have two cards and I am not really earning any more than when I had 1 card…

[svennand]

[quote name=“netnerd” post=“26090” timestamp=“1377201549”]
here we go again already at 9.5gh :'( defo not fair for loyal FTC miners like myself, please do something :-\
Not very encouraging, as I am throwing every bit of spare cash at FTC trying to get a 4x7950 rig together ( I AM NOT RICH!!!), I now have two cards and I am not really earning any more than when I had 1 card…
[/quote]

dont get despair, its an investment=), now the ftc is really low on the exchange.
I do however not think this will last for very long ;)
Just keep on mining those ftc’s :D