Renting mining rigs

Ahhh… the wussies way out :D XD

Get your hands dirty! Build your own rig!

Once it’s no longer useful, sell it for parts, or sell it whole to a newcomer so they have at least something to play with.

Build, mine, hold. Spend some, gift some and share your knowledge to help the next guy.

The whole point of crypto’s is to actually have control over your wealth. By renting rigs all your doing is re-increasing risk as a factor…

Renting rigs, cloud hashing etc, is self defeating and ruins the control you have. All it does is encourage centralisation.

Thytos

[quote name=“CloudScrypt” post=“56158” timestamp=“1391127221”]
If you mine FTC today then yeah its better to buy the coin, but other coins are profitable and FTC could change either way as well… you get to have a go at mining without the noise, heat, power issues, capital investment etc.
[/quote]

Its more than that: even if the value of mining FTC vs buying FTC was the same, imho it would be better to mine because you would be not only getting FTC but also helping to increase the total FTC network, which in turn helps increase FTC value.

[quote author=Calem link=topic=7318.msg56183#msg56183 date=1391134204]
Build, mine, hold. Spend some, gift some and share your knowledge to help the next guy.

The whole point of crypto’s is to actually have control over your wealth. By renting rigs all your doing is re-increasing risk as a factor.

Renting rigs, cloud hashing etc, is self defeating and ruins the control you have. All it does is encourage centralisation.
[/quote]

I agree with you to a certain extent: These kind of services, expecially cloud hashing, lead to some centralisation… BUT! that naturally happened with BTC and it didnt hurt there as far I know. More, in cryptoworld, crypto is wealth, not hardware (unless of course crypto collapses and hardware becomes the remaining wealth for all of us). Also, the risk here is no higher than pre-ordering a scrypt ASIC which may never come or come too late to make a difference.

edit: To conclude: a coin will gain value with increasing merchant adoption (external factor) + network power/stability (internal factor). Buying FTC straight from the market, even if its apparently the more profitable way and helps miners to sell in the short term, does nothing to help those 2 main factors and will help nothing in the long run.

Joe90

[quote name=“Thytos” post=“56141” timestamp=“1391122474”]
As I see it, if you leasing your hardware, that means you are looking for the short term profit, so it seems logical than anyone leasing will only do so at a price higher that what they can get mining themelves.

On the other hand, paying to rent makes sense if you are thinking long term and putting that hashing power into coins which you think will be more valuable in the future and you want to stock as many as you can now.

The price you see there is not determined by any unique person, it is the product of supply and demand factors and so far it seems that ~0.0190BTC/MHs/day is the balance point.
[/quote]

if you want to stockpile you can still buy them outright cheaper than renting these rigs, by renting your just making someone else a lot of money…

[quote name=“Joe90” post=“56353” timestamp=“1391208104”]
by renting your just making someone else a lot of money…
[/quote]

I don’t exactly know who your are Joe90, but I agree with this particular quote…

mmyhre

[quote]Get your hands dirty! Build your own rig![/quote]

Could not agree more than that.

tester555

Link in your original post is wrong, it is leaserig.net and I have been using it - love the new bulk feature - can load pool on all my rigs very fast!

You guys are not giving up on this cloud hashing stuff are you?

Please don’t think I’m pointing fingers, but there seems to be a lot of cloud mining circle jerking going on since the Scryptcloud scam…

[url=https://forum.feathercoin.com/index.php/topic,7176.0.html]https://forum.feathercoin.com/index.php/topic,7176.0.html[/url]

Thytos

[quote name=“tester555” post=“56932” timestamp=“1391479012”]
Link in your original post is wrong, it is leaserig.net and I have been using it - love the new bulk feature - can load pool on all my rigs very fast!
[/quote]

Thanks, corrected.

[quote author=Calem link=topic=7318.msg56933#msg56933 date=1391479730]
You guys are not giving up on this cloud hashing stuff are you?

Please don’t think I’m pointing fingers, but there seems to be a lot of cloud mining circle jerking going on since the Scryptcloud scam…

[url=https://forum.feathercoin.com/index.php/topic,7176.0.html]https://forum.feathercoin.com/index.php/topic,7176.0.html[/url]
[/quote]

Heheh Calem :) No, I have not given up on cloud hashing stuff, but I must say my initial impetus was somewhat refrained after reading some opinions here… Still, I see some benefits in cloudhashing and the prices now seem stable around 0.014-0.015BTC/MH/day which I think are good prices.

And yes, the Scryptcloud scam actually aftected a bit these early days of scrypt cloud mining as a whole, though I believe decent work from other people will eventually surpass it.

scruffters

I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

I think cex.io describe it well “commodity exchange”.

Also what is not to like?

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validate crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

We’re in the calm period before the storm. Only a tiny fraction of the population know about crypto. However when/if it gets really big, I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…

Thytos

[quote name=“scruffters” post=“56984” timestamp=“1391510905”]
I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validates crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…
[/quote]

I agree with those same 3 points.

CloudScrypt

[quote name=“Thytos” post=“56993” timestamp=“1391515400”]
[quote author=scruffters link=topic=7318.msg56984#msg56984 date=1391510905]
I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validates crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…
[/quote]

I agree with those same 3 points.
[/quote]

+1, I see it as a very viable introduction for some, and alternative for others - of course there will always be the hardcore builders! ;D

jti8899

[quote name=“CloudScrypt” post=“56994” timestamp=“1391515772”]
[quote author=Thytos link=topic=7318.msg56993#msg56993 date=1391515400]
[quote author=scruffters link=topic=7318.msg56984#msg56984 date=1391510905]
I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validates crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…
[/quote]

I agree with those same 3 points.
[/quote]

+1, I see it as a very viable introduction for some, and alternative for others - of course there will always be the hardcore builders! ;D
[/quote]

I can see various reason someone would want to lease their rigs to others, the obvious being profit short term.

I can also see many reasons why others would want to lease a rig (like a car, or furniture and appliances) the obvious being lower responsibility for the equipment, although at a higher cost. Just because a person could take a bus for cheaper then leasing a car, does not mean leasing a car is not a viable alternative for them. Maybe they want to learn about mining and receive coins with no fiat paper trail to them, without the cost and headaches of buying and building a mining rig. I have built them and it is no task for the average, never built anything kind of person. Maybe a better example would be leasing a washer and dryer vs going to the laundromat?

With all that said, wouldn’t there be a way to let rig owners place their rigs up as an offer, while people who want to lease a rig placing their intent up as an ask, on a decentralized blockchain type transaction “open transactions” style and they could find one another and interact peer to peer with no third “trusted Party” in the middle? isn’t this where we are all going anyway?

This way people who enjoy building and maintaining mining rigs could build decentralized autonomous companies and do what they love. Others could buy the coins produced and do what they love. The networks would gain in diversified mining pools. Only losers I see here are the banks . . . boo hoo!

Just a thought,
~//~

+1 CloudScrypt

Joe90

[quote name=“jti8899” post=“57144” timestamp=“1391568293”]
[quote author=CloudScrypt link=topic=7318.msg56994#msg56994 date=1391515772]
[quote author=Thytos link=topic=7318.msg56993#msg56993 date=1391515400]
[quote author=scruffters link=topic=7318.msg56984#msg56984 date=1391510905]
I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validates crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…
[/quote]

I agree with those same 3 points.
[/quote]

+1, I see it as a very viable introduction for some, and alternative for others - of course there will always be the hardcore builders! ;D
[/quote]

I can see various reason someone would want to lease their rigs to others, the obvious being profit short term.

I can also see many reasons why others would want to lease a rig (like a car, or furniture and appliances) the obvious being lower responsibility for the equipment, although at a higher cost. Just because a person could take a bus for cheaper then leasing a car, does not mean leasing a car is not a viable alternative for them. Maybe they want to learn about mining and receive coins with no fiat paper trail to them, without the cost and headaches of buying and building a mining rig. I have built them and it is no task for the average, never built anything kind of person. Maybe a better example would be leasing a washer and dryer vs going to the laundromat?

With all that said, wouldn’t there be a way to let rig owners place their rigs up as an offer, while people who want to lease a rig placing their intent up as an ask, on a decentralized blockchain type transaction “open transactions” style and they could find one another and interact peer to peer with no third “trusted Party” in the middle? isn’t this where we are all going anyway?

This way people who enjoy building and maintaining mining rigs could build decentralized autonomous companies and do what they love. Others could buy the coins produced and do what they love. The networks would gain in diversified mining pools. Only losers I see here are the banks . . . boo hoo!

Just a thought,
~//~

+1 CloudScrypt
[/quote]

I really have to disagree with you on that… You have to pay with bitcoins anyway, so its cheaper and faster to just buy some coin outright…

And if your going to learn about mining, paying for someone else to do it for you is not a good start, maybe using an old computer or something would be more practical for learning…

Maybe it might be more worth while when scrypt Asic’s are more widely available.

jti8899

[quote name=“Joe90” post=“57174” timestamp=“1391577633”]
[quote author=jti8899 link=topic=7318.msg57144#msg57144 date=1391568293]
[quote author=CloudScrypt link=topic=7318.msg56994#msg56994 date=1391515772]
[quote author=Thytos link=topic=7318.msg56993#msg56993 date=1391515400]
[quote author=scruffters link=topic=7318.msg56984#msg56984 date=1391510905]
I expect scrypt cloud hashing services will become more important in the future. It happened (to an extent) with BTC.

As a service, these types of arrangement only further validates crypto as an industry. I think that is quite important, actually.

I can’t see average folks building their own rigs. But rental could do very well in the long term…
[/quote]

I agree with those same 3 points.
[/quote]

+1, I see it as a very viable introduction for some, and alternative for others - of course there will always be the hardcore builders! ;D
[/quote]

I can see various reason someone would want to lease their rigs to others, the obvious being profit short term.

I can also see many reasons why others would want to lease a rig (like a car, or furniture and appliances) the obvious being lower responsibility for the equipment, although at a higher cost. Just because a person could take a bus for cheaper then leasing a car, does not mean leasing a car is not a viable alternative for them. Maybe they want to learn about mining and receive coins with no fiat paper trail to them, without the cost and headaches of buying and building a mining rig. I have built them and it is no task for the average, never built anything kind of person. Maybe a better example would be leasing a washer and dryer vs going to the laundromat?

With all that said, wouldn’t there be a way to let rig owners place their rigs up as an offer, while people who want to lease a rig placing their intent up as an ask, on a decentralized blockchain type transaction “open transactions” style and they could find one another and interact peer to peer with no third “trusted Party” in the middle? isn’t this where we are all going anyway?

This way people who enjoy building and maintaining mining rigs could build decentralized autonomous companies and do what they love. Others could buy the coins produced and do what they love. The networks would gain in diversified mining pools. Only losers I see here are the banks . . . boo hoo!

Just a thought,
~//~

+1 CloudScrypt
[/quote]

I really have to disagree with you on that… You have to pay with bitcoins anyway, so its cheaper and faster to just buy some coin outright…

And if your going to learn about mining, paying for someone else to do it for you is not a good start, maybe using an old computer or something would be more practical for learning…

Maybe it might be more worth while when scrypt Asic’s are more widely available.
[/quote]

This is all from your personal perspective though (and I respect that) but, I spent over 1,000USD to get a mining rig up, not counting time in research, assembly and ongoing configuration and I like building things. Someone else, and I know some of these people, would be willing to pay more per coin, to mine over buy, but see leasing a rig short term as a better way to get their feet wet. They are all over the US for USD through PayPal as well so it isn’t just BTC contracts.

There are many different types of people. I personally would be of the same opinion as you and would just buy them before I leased someone’s miner, but then there is the question of “where do I buy them?” for some people who wanted to buy, and asked that question the easiest answer they found was to lease mining rig time.

Regardless how any of us believe people should do things, there is a hugh open opportunity to fill the nitch created by the people with rigs wanting to lease them out for BTC or USD or EUR and the people without wanting to rent them to gain crypto. I personally can’t believe the rent to own places stay in business. I see their ads and think “who would rent that for that much? hell just buy it”, yet their trucks are all over town delivering stuff.

peace
~//~

Although I have an own mining rig at home, I am still fan of idea to rent mining rigs online. I checked out leaserig.net but the prices there are ridiculous high. I pay more then I get.

Thytos

You should try www.betarigs.com . I have been looking at both sites and the prices are usually lower here and the renting process is more straightforward.

As for the discussion above… i agree when you say that we can’t expect everyone to build a mining rig, thats not feasible. I also think its more logical for the average human who is getting acquainted with crypto and wants to try it out, to choose renting over buying mining rigs.

And for the prices, those will always be higher than what you can make short term with the same hashpower. That obvious: whoever is renting is looking for short term profit and will only rent for a price higher than what they can do themselves.

I haven’t found any rig on betarigs.com worth to rent. Well at least for mining Litecoins or Feathercoins.

If you can afford to buy a car why would you rent it?

The only reason is because you expect that you will no longer need or want said car once your done using it…

If you really believe in a particular coin, renting only shows you lack of faith in it.

Granted, regardless if your renting or owning a rig, one could easily jump ship and change coin to mine, but my point still stands. By buying the hardware, your voting with your fiat that you don’t wish to return back to said government issued currency.

I still can not understand why you would want to rent a rig. It shows lack of trust and faith.

I’ve said it once, I’m now saying it twice.

Buy the printer, don’t rent it.

Your just giving someone who has more trust in the fundamental philosophy of been in control of your own money, more of your own money…

jti8899

[quote name=“Calem” post=“57428” timestamp=“1391672449”]
If you can afford to buy a car why would you rent it?

The only reason is because you expect that you will no longer need or want said car once your done using it…

If you really believe in a particular coin, renting only shows you lack of faith in it.

Granted, regardless if your renting or owning a rig, one could easily jump ship and change coin to mine, but my point still stands. By buying the hardware, your voting with your fiat that you don’t wish to return back to said government issued currency.

I still can not understand why you would want to rent a rig. It shows lack of trust and faith.

I’ve said it once, I’m now saying it twice.

Buy the printer, don’t rent it.

Your just giving someone who has more trust in the fundamental philosophy of been in control of your own money, more of your own money…
[/quote]

Who is more committed to the crypto in question, the guy who builds a rig and leases it to dump the coins it produces at a profit in fiat, or the guy who rents his rig and holds and uses those coins in place of fiat?

I own a car, but rent one anytime I leave town on vacation so someone else deals with any breakdown issues! Just one reason someone might rent when they can buy.

~//~

[quote name=“jti8899” post=“57437” timestamp=“1391676656”]
Who is more committed to the crypto in question, the guy who builds a rig and leases it to dump the coins it produces at a profit in fiat, or the guy who rents his rig and holds and uses those coins in place of fiat?
~//~
[/quote]

The guy who rents the other guys rig of course. Dumping coins for fiat is obviously a show of lack of faith.

This doesn’t take into account the guy who builds his own rig and mines with it himself.

The point I’m trying to make, is investing in the hardware yourself shows more loyalty than taking less risk by allowing someone else to be left holding useless hardware.