How can we make Crypto currency fair?
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[quote name=“gavztheouch” post=“38428” timestamp=“1385921720”]
Wasn’t feathecoin mined for months during a ‘testing phase’ by the developers?
[/quote]There might have been a testnet for Feathercoin, but those coins get destroyed/are useless. Feathercoin did not have a pre-mine, if that’s the real thing you are trying to say. The first block was created AFTER the announcement on BitcoinTalk.
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Yes that was what I was trying to say, and I accept I could be wrong on that. However whether the first miners be 1,3,5 or 100,000 its still only a small % of potential coin users that were made privy to the info of a new coin and started mining from the start with a distinct advantage. How can you argue that this is fair?
Im not saying this is unique to feather or any other coin. But you can’t deny that the system is rigged and from the outside looking in it looks no fairer than Fiat. Wasn’t the whole point of the crypto revolution to make money fair and take the power away from the banks. It might be taking power away from the banks but it is not a fair system from the outset.
[quote]Why does it need to be fair?[/quote]
[quote]Exactly…lol[/quote]Quote of the month, sound like a right bunch of bankers
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Its easy to poke holes in something but unless you can come up with a solution its just hot air.
I would be the first to jump on board with any other way that would be fair.
But I think what you are looking for is communism.
Where no one is rich and everything is equal is that what you mean by fair. That’s a nice thought but its doubtful anyone will ever achieve that. -
As Kris mentioned, your only course of action to the problem you are proposing exists is to come up with a viable, working solution - AND - make it successful. Good luck with that!
You’re upset with what we call early adopters. Unfortunately, that is how the dice roll in life. Not only for crypto-coins, but for any technology at all. For example, the first people to use steel instead of brass in weaponry had an advantage. Gunpowder vs swords. Air power vs ground troops. The early adopters in crypto took risks, spending processing power and electricity to support a technology they were interested in. For a few years even Bitcoin looked to many like a waste of time. Coins were sold at 1 cent for a while.
Which brings it into the next topic, that of the inherent nature of currency as a means of use. There are hoarders, but there are also mine & dumpers, active traders, people who push to spend crypto as currency, and even tippers or gifters. Coins move around and get spread out - it’s their intended purpose after all.
Finally, life isn’t fair. Whether from an evolutionary point of view, or business, or love. Shit happens - some people win, and some people lose. I don’t think human nature has meant for it to be any other way either. Communism was an ideal that ultimately failed because of the human factor.
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[quote name=“mnstrcck” post=“38458” timestamp=“1385928210”]
Communism was an ideal that ultimately failed because of the human factor.
[/quote]You know, I was waiting for someone to bring that up?
I for one am so incredibly excited to be an early adopter. I’m one of the very very very very very very few people in this world that will ever own an entire Bitcoin, and I’m entitled to it BECAUSE I’m taking the risk of early adoption. I’d call that more than fair: I’m risking my own wealth on a new technology. Maybe it’ll pay off, maybe it won’t.
Either way, evolution dictates a meritocracy where those with the most adaptable qualities survive, and those who overspecialize die off in a changing environment. You ignore that fact, and you’ll find yourself without the skills to survive. It’s a cut-throat world we live in and there’s no points awarded for second place.
Coffee is for closers only!
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kZg_ALxEz0#]Glengarry Glen Ross speech[/url]
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Kevlar, thanks for that.
I should also point out that Leninist-Marxist Communism [taking Russia as an example] was also highly beneficial for “early adopters”*. In fact, the same could be said for Nazi Fascism, Maoist Communism and Pol Pot’s Cambodian Communist Revolution. FUCKING EARLY ADOPTERS!
[sub]It should be noted however that many early adopters of the Russian Communist era were also seen as a threat and either expunged or, as the Communists so lovingly used to say, liquidated. For further reading, see Trotsky.[/sub]
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The funny thing is when looking back this new wave of people buying into crypto right now today will be seen as early adopters.
It is still so early in the life of crypto its unreal people have barely scratched the surface but knowledge is not spread in a linear fashion its exponential. Not one person I know in the real world mines / owns crypto not one. If this is the standard then we are a million miles from at the top of this thing.As I keep reading “To the moon etc etc”
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Last year I purchased just shy of 100 bitcoins at about £3 each and left them. Unfortunately earlier this year when things were a bit tight I remembered about them and checked the price. I was shocked when they were nearly £20 and traded them in. Don’t I feel silly now ! Well actually I feel like I lost a lottery ticket but you win some, you lose some …
Well suffice to say I am now right back into looking at crypto & have found my way to FTC. I have decided that I am going to mainly invest in FTC although I will also get some LTC too
I agree, why should crypto be ‘fair’. I hope that this really becomes revolution up there with the invention of the internet. I also hope by speculating and being and early adopter I become wealthy. Hopefully we all will
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The unfair thing about cryptocurrency IMO might be the way new coins are created.
If those with more computational power generate more, then the process is centralized, owned by a few rich groups/individuals.
Maybe generation of coins should not have been based on computational power or something that can be easily automated. -
[quote]Where no one is rich and everything is equal is that what you mean by fair. That’s a nice thought but its doubtful anyone will ever achieve that.[/quote]
No Im not a communist, a true capitalist free market society with minimal goverment would be my preffered choice in UK and I have nothing against the rich. I only have a problem with bitcoin and feather coin [b]if[/b] in the future I am forced to partake in selling my products for these coins because the free market has choosen them as a viable method of wealth transfer. If I choose not to use them I would be failing to adapt, and hurting my bussiness in return. I would feel like I am being forced to take part in something I thought was rigged, I mean you guys are freely admiting you are hoarding to profit.
Anyway this thread is going off track, it appears the answer is to the question is [b]suck it life aint fair[/b]
Lets see where crypto goes in the next few months, hopefully in the trash so the 99.9999% of us that don’t hold any can build a better system.
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[quote name=“gavztheouch” post=“38545” timestamp=“1385949240”]
I only have a problem with bitcoin and feather coin if in the future I am forced to partake in selling my products for these coins because the [b]free market has choosen[/b] them as a viable method of wealth transfer. If I choose not to use them I would be failing to adapt, and hurting my bussiness in return. I would feel like [b]I am being forced[/b] to take part in something I thought was rigged…
[/quote]I’m sorry, but you are not making sense. If the free market you so espouse chooses either BTC or FTC as the standard - and you do not adapt with the free market, then you are simply being an idiot. No one forces you to do anything - but not adapting to market expectations is BAD BUSINESS.
I’m really have no idea what your points are. Can you please give them to me bullet point or something? This is so confusing.
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Crypto currency ≠source of easy income. Early adopters & miners have solved a social problem of giant dimensions. You are failing to notice what they missed reading math books in their youth. Their salary is for courage, faith and work. Today, miners are merely paid guards. Their salary is meager. If you don’t believe, become one of them. For the rest of us, crypto means merely that it pays off to work again. You won’t be able to pull off miracle profits on cryptos anymore (Feathercoin being possible exception as of now), but do what you are good at, work, invent, create, and your salary won’t go down the drain as it does in the legacy system. The power of the industrial complex is so great, that we will not have to work overtime to afford a private electric aiplane. The advent of cryptos merely means that this power will no longer go into building useless boxes of glass and steel in the city centers, but to those who solve the problems â€" and we have many of those left to solve. If you want buy cryptos, view it as a (temporary) donation. Donate only so much as you can miss on the long run. The currency has 0 intrinsic value, your donation means that you paying the community members salary for solving the problem of making your crypto usable for everyday purchases in the future.
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Hi I don’t see why crypto currencies should be fair, and agree with the sentiments that this would be communism and render the currencies virtually pointless because an equally distributed amount would be just a dead market. I think what’s great about crypto is that it is the purest expression of capitalism, it is an attempt to see if capitalism can work ‘without’ regulators. We shouldn’t let notions of fairness get in the way of all this good fun :)
I also don’t mind if satoshi or FTC devs mined a few million coins before release whether true or not I say good on them. If they are going to bust their butts and bring something to market they should get fat shares in the company of course they should, I know if I made a coin I’m damn sure I would mine some :) :) :)
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I think its important to point out that FTC was created without pre-mine specifically because that concept is unfair.
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[quote]I’m sorry, but you are not making sense. If the free market you so espouse chooses either BTC or FTC as the standard - and you do not adapt with the free market, then you are simply being an idiot. No one forces you to do anything - but not adapting to market expectations is BAD BUSINESS.[/quote]
I do not see what is so confusing to be honest. You have basicly just repeated what I have just said in your own words?
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You said you would be forced, but, in reality, there is no force involved. That’s the beauty of the market. You’re free to follow the trends of the market or to abandon them, to your own success or detriment. The cream rises to the top.
I believe fairness and freedom tend to be mutually exclusive; if not always, they trend that way. Freedom does not support fairness through any means, if you think that fairness means that all things are equal for everyone. However, if you believe that fairness means that people have the rights and freedoms to make their own way and succeed, then freedom means the ultimate fair playing field. There are no restrictions, no governments stepping in the way of profitable businesses which provide valuable services; there is only the freedom to forge one’s own path and make greatnessâ€"or to fail spectacularly, but that’s the beauty of it all.
Cryptocurrency helps with this because it removes the shackles of the State, something which cannot exist if one desires a free market or freedom in totality. Yes, minarchism and free market ideals are mutually exclusive. One must reject the State in order to achieve a pure free market. (Joke of the day: What’s the difference between a minarchist and anarchist? About six months.)
If we truly desire to move society forward, we must get away from these anachronistic ideals of fairness and equality. Things will never be entirely fair or equal, but freedom must be available for all in equal measures. I believe that is the ultimate test of fairness.
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[quote name=“kris_davison” post=“38587” timestamp=“1385972648”]
I think its important to point out that FTC was created without pre-mine specifically because that concept is unfair.
[/quote]Except for the genesis block, right?
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Oh come on now. The Genesis block doesn’t actually allow any coins to be created last I checked.
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[quote name=“gavztheouch” post=“38428” timestamp=“1385921720”]
I disagree that in a fair by the people for the people currency early adoptors [b]should[/b] get a premium or addtional coins. Just because a system of mining was used for alt/bitcoins does not mean a perfect currency should do it this way. Wasn’t feathecoin mined for months during a ‘testing phase’ by the developers?
[/quote]NO.
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[quote name=“Aldanga” post=“38786” timestamp=“1386005476”]
I believe fairness and freedom tend to be mutually exclusive; if not always, they trend that way.
[/quote]You’re confusing equality with fairness. Fairness means risk gets reward. Equality means equal work gets equal pay. Truth is most people wouldn’t be motivated at all if they had to think about every little detail. Too much to think about and keep track of. One advantage of freedom is you don’t have to wait for the perfect scenario. You take a chance.
Also, who cares if you miss the boat or not. I have seen quite a bit of money pass through my hands where I traded for coin and which I made a bit on.
